To budget or not to budget.. that is the question

Online Users: 0 guest(s), 0 user(s). Replies: 36


ArtBride Posts : 4,838 Registered: 5/9/07
Re: To budget or not to budget.. that is the question
Posted: May 12, 2010 10:53 AM Go to message in response to: cyndi33

Cyndi, I thought the same thing when I read that response. It's TOTALLY on-topic. But since my advice is apparently going to be ignored, I regret wasting my time responding. Oh well - hopefully someone else will be able to learn from it.

And now I might get a PM about how the secret to financial success is living paycheck to paycheck? Awesome!

DaisypathWedding Ticker

Vice President and Guardian of the Toilet Brush of POOP: People Offended by Offended People

Reply


cyndi33 Posts : 2,585 Registered: 1/3/07
Re: To budget or not to budget.. that is the question
Posted: May 12, 2010 11:07 AM Go to message in response to: ArtBride

The advice I got (not from the PP but from a 20 something I know personally) was, you just live on love and, education, working your way up, etc, is bad for your kids so, all one really needs to do is "love" them. DH and I were very impressed, and also saddened to realize that we must never have "loved" our kids.

However, the advice on here is useful and I'm sure some people will pay attention. For those listening and interested, there is always awesome advice available on these boards.

 Proud Member of P.O.O.P.,  People Offended by Offended People

Reply

christinagsu Posts : 50 Registered: 11/18/08
Re: To budget or not to budget.. that is the question
Posted: May 12, 2010 11:12 AM Go to message in response to: ArtBride

Really? You guys have got to be kidding me?!

The only reason I chose to use the media "private message" was because it was not in response to the person that originally asked a question in this thread. My apologies to TrippleDagger.


The other 3 of you (Aunt, Cyndi, Art)....My message to Aunt (and now you) is that you guys obviously were not raised in the same financial standing as I. My assumption by the fact that this girls father having enough money to give her $20,000 is that she was raised a little like me. The fact that I currently live "paycheck to paycheck" simply means that when I was 23 I decided to get a job and stop having everything handed to me. If some big catastrophic event happens that takes me out of my job....gues what!!! I have parents! They will handle it. You guys called me a "entitled brat" in another thread....my mother read that and her response was "they just don't know how much I love you". If my mother chooses to give me money or is financially able to be my backing in life....what the heck does it matter to you?! The poor girls question was about a wedding!!!!! Not her money and wealth (or as you 3 are assuming lack there of).

Oh, I also mentioned to her that she should not assume someone in their twenties only makes $20K per year and doesn't contribute to society, any charities, or a 401K, because none of those things apply to me and I am in my twenties.

Reply


auntofthebride Posts : 9,354 Registered: 4/2/06
Re: To budget or not to budget.. that is the question
Posted: May 12, 2010 11:17 AM Go to message in response to: christinagsu

Dear Christina,

Forward a private message? I'll do better than that. I will post publically the private message. I was absolutely appalled by your naïveté when I read the message. If you want to depend on your parents the rest of your life, that's your choice. I came from upper-middle class parents who did me the huge favor of teaching me to stand on my own two feet.

I quote:

Look, you obviously don't like anything I say, that is fine. But can you please lay off of me publicly? You obviously did not grow up the same way I did and I could tell by that girl's posting that she DID grow up the same way I did. Money is NO object to us. Here is why....Although I currently live "paycheck to paycheck" if I had an emergency or something to happen where I needed money, my mother and father would handle it. To me, if a girl is saying that her dad is handing her $20,000 then it likely she is in my same boat. I understand completely what you are saying and in most American cases you are ABSOLUTELY CORRECT, however, when a child comes from wealth or a subset thereof, but is trying to live on their own, the same rules do not apply. Oh, and please don't assume that someone in their twenties is making $20K and year and not contributing to society or a 401K or anything the like if they say "paycheck to paycheck" because I fit none of those criteria. I don't even KNOW of a job that pays that little this day in age...you are 50 something...maybe back in the day. If I felt the girl needed the money, then yes, I would have suggested otherwise because to most American's in their current debt state and economical state, I would suggest using that $20 to get out of debt or to have for a rainy day. This particular case I didn't see that suggestion necessary. Do you understand why? Oh, quite sure you are going to respond with something about the future and if my (or this girls) parents are no longer living, what will I (or anyone in this case) do? Here's my answer: At time of death, the child will inherit enough to be a very substantial fund (emergency fund as you are calling it). Does this help? I am not trying to be rude, however, you and I have gotten off on the wrong foot and I would like to amend the situation in a non public manner so that we can continue enjoying this wonderful website.

Reply


ArtBride Posts : 4,838 Registered: 5/9/07
Re: To budget or not to budget.. that is the question
Posted: May 12, 2010 11:26 AM Go to message in response to: christinagsu

Oh, now we've upset her.

Christina, that's great that your parents will support you in an emergency. My parents would help me, too - if it really came down to it. But guess what? I'm a grown-up and shouldn't need their help, so I choose to be financially responsible rather than blowing through my paychecks and relying on my parents to help me if something goes wrong.

We are assuming that this girl has no money because she TOLD US that she lives paycheck to paycheck. I agree that that doesn't mean that she's destitute, but someone in that financial situation could sure use 20K. We are commenting on her finances because she ASKED US whether she should take the 20K or spend it on a wedding. The answer to that depends on her financial situation.

Regarding the assumption that someone in her 20s only makes 20K, I never said or implied that. I am still in my 20s and make much more than that, yet I'm still not where I want to be financially. Again, the OP TOLD US that she lives paycheck to paycheck. You can do that on 100K the same as you can on 20K. I was never assuming that you or the OP makes any particular salary. I'm assuming that you're financially irresponsible because both of you admitted that you live paycheck to paycheck.

And no, I don't come from a different economic status than you. I was raised in an upper-middle class home and my parents are very comfortable - but they worked to achieve that success, much like AOTB described about herself. But I was also raised to value my own accomplishments more than what others can give me, and I expect to work to acheive my own success and financial security. Yes, if I ever had a true emergency, my parents could help me - and they have, in the past. But I would never choose to burden them if I had another option, so I choose to be financially responsible (as I was taught by my parents) so that I can stand on my own two feet. Because, you know, I'm a married adult and all, and I should have a better emergency plan than my mommy.

DaisypathWedding Ticker

Vice President and Guardian of the Toilet Brush of POOP: People Offended by Offended People

Reply


auntofthebride Posts : 9,354 Registered: 4/2/06
Re: To budget or not to budget.. that is the question
Posted: May 12, 2010 11:51 AM Go to message in response to: ArtBride

dear AB,

"Regarding the assumption that someone in her 20s only makes 20K, I never said or implied that."

I implied that, in the sense that if the couple takes half of the offered $20k and puts that into an emergency fund, and if their goal is six months income and if (big if) their annual salary is $20k, then $10k would entirely fund their emergency fund.

If the couple makes more than $20k/year then $10k would fund part of their emergency fund.

" Yes, if I ever had a true emergency, my parents could help me - and they have, in the past."

Yes, and my parents would have, too, and I would help my own children (now in their 20s) if they really had a true emergency.

A young person in their 20s are on a bridge to financial independence. A typical hard-working 20-year old is getting their own paycheck, living in their own place, but is in the process of establishing the emergency fund, buying a house, having children and starting retirement planning. They are on their own two feet, but it's shaky. I see nothing wrong with Mom and Dad being there in case there is a true emergency that knocks the kid off their feet.

However, I do expect the kid to work towards the point where they can handle even a true emergency on their own. That point should come in the early 30s. When my children are in their 30s, I expect to be fully retired and worried only about supporting myself into my old age.

Right now, I have an investment that is quietly dedicated to bailing out a kid. So far, we haven't had to tap into that, but it's there just in case. Once my children pass 35, or so, that investment will be cashed out and put to use elsewhere.

All money comes with strings attached, especially money given from one's parents. I chose not to accept the strings that would have come had I allowed myself to be supported by my parents. If I were supporting either of my adult children, damn right, there would be strings. Heavy, difficult, ego-crushing strings. Strings that would motivate the kid to get off the couch and get a job, any job, to get out from under Mom and Dad's thumb.

Finally: Parental money can fail. Rich people can get wiped out. Look at all those Bernie Madoff investors. They were left with nothing. Look at all the hedge fund managers who were, suddenly, no warning, let go. You are making $3m/year at Lehmann Bros? Sorry, Bub, clean out your desk.

Reply


ArtBride Posts : 4,838 Registered: 5/9/07
Re: To budget or not to budget.. that is the question
Posted: May 12, 2010 11:57 AM Go to message in response to: auntofthebride

Oh yay - I get to read the nasty PM without taking the trouble to check whether I have any PMs. I still never notice them on this setup - that was much easier on the old boards.

So...wow. I'm also appalled at the naivete and don't have much else to say, apart from what has already been said.

Except I do. You're assuming that the OP is a trust-fund baby simply because her parents have 20K to give her for her wedding. Yawn. Probably not true. Lots of parents save money for their children's weddings. My ILs, who will likely not leave anything other than debt for their kids to pay off, gave a substantial sum to each of their children for their weddings. They're certainly not wealthy - they are generous and not very financially responsible. I would have much rather they kept the money that they gave to us before our wedding, as they need it much more than we do.

My mom's best friend contributes very generously to her adult children's lives, paying for lavish weddings, downpayments on houses, etc, etc. Little do those kids know that their parents were hit REALLY hard by the economy and they're really just working to keep up appearances now. Unless you balance your parents's checkbooks, you don't know their true financial situation. What if the OP's parents don't have anything other than this 20K? Who, then, will support the OP and her husband if an emergency comes up?

And what if the OP is not an only child? If you're an only child, your parents have tons of money, and you're not too proud to mooch off them, that's one thing - but when a couple has several children, even large resources can be stretched thin. Not to mention the cost of long-term care for their own elderly parents. What if the OP's parents have financial obligations to others, not just to helping the OP in emergencies?

But I forgot that the OP must have the same exact life situation as you, based on the fact that both your parents offered money for the wedding.


DaisypathWedding Ticker

Vice President and Guardian of the Toilet Brush of POOP: People Offended by Offended People

Reply

christinagsu Posts : 50 Registered: 11/18/08
Re: To budget or not to budget.. that is the question
Posted: May 12, 2010 12:06 PM Go to message in response to: auntofthebride

Fully agree with you Aunt, things do happen in life and you gave great examples. In fact, the economy has completely hit my parents, so I get that.

Art- you know what...you are so right too! I did make an assumption, that I probably shouldn't have made. I have a best friend that is Indian and their parents save their whole lives for those weddings...I should have really thought of that. Your statement about the same situation because our parents gave us money for a wedding -> not true, I never said my parents are paying for my wedding. In fact, they are not. I am currently saving for my own wedding payments. Also, you said that I don't know about my parents money because I don't balance their checkbook...but my mother happens to be my BEST Friend in life, we talk about EVERYTHING, and so I do know...But I completely understand what you mean because when I was younger she didn't talk to me about those things and I am sure that I have a different relationship with my mother than some people do, hence, I see where you are comig from on that one.

Reply


dodgercpkl Posts : 130 Registered: 9/27/09
Re: To budget or not to budget.. that is the question
Posted: May 12, 2010 12:22 PM Go to message in response to: VšnTillBruden

"VšnTillBruden wrote:OP, I used to live in southern California. And let me tell you something: that $20,000 your dad has promised you will most likely not get you a big, white wedding with 300 guests in attendance, unless you plan on contributing some of your own savings, which I doubt you have much to spare, since you say you live paycheck to paycheck. With how expensive various vendors and venues are in California, you're much better off taking your father's offer to have a backyard wedding, and keep that money for something else. I would kill to have that kind of money given to me and told "Take it for whatever you need"."

I agree that she should take the money and have a backyard wedding, however I have to point out that I'm in So Cal and I'm NOT having a backyard wedding and my final budget looks like it will be under $6k. It's not been easy, but with alot of research, I'm having the wedding of my dreams in So Cal for under $6k.

Everything depends on what each persons dreams are and what's most important to them. To us it was saving a very nice chunk of the money that my folks gave us so that we could build our savings. To us also, we found that we could make this beautiful event happen on much much less then the averages say in my area.


Reply


VšnTillBruden Posts : 353 Registered: 1/16/10
Re: To budget or not to budget.. that is the question
Posted: May 12, 2010 4:08 PM Go to message in response to: dodgercpkl

Dodger, the OP wrote that her dream wedding was big, formal, and white. With a Vera Wang gown and all. My post said something to the effect of "If you want your big, white wedding, with 300 people in attendance, 20 grand isn't going to cut it." I'm thrilled that you've kept your budget so well, Dodger, that's absolutely wonderful. I'm very impressed that you handled it for 6,000 (I've heard of people spending that on catering alone. Isn't that scary? Welcome to L.A. and Hollywood). But I doubt OP's "dream wedding" could be done on the same budget.

Love me when I least deserve it, because that is when I need it the most. (Swedish proverb)

Reply


MsDenuninani Posts : 3,962 Registered: 3/16/07
Re: To budget or not to budget.. that is the question
Posted: May 12, 2010 4:38 PM Go to message in response to: christinagsu

Christine, this morning I almost posted something that was somewhat, but not entirely, sympathetic to your first post, but I didn't because I realized that I too was making assumptions. I agree with the others who've said that your PM reflected a startling naivete.

Anyways, my problem is that I see the phrase "paycheck to paycheck" as subject to interpretation. She said that they aren't in near poverty, so what I gleaned is that they can afford to pay their bills, but not much more. But without knowing what their bills are and exactly how they spend their income, it's hard to say if that really means they don't have more money than needed.

I consider myself as living paycheck to paycheck, but that's because literally every penny is accounted for, with much of my income going to debt-repayment and savings (approximately 45%). The amounts that go in there are fixed, and I consider savings/debt repayment like any other bill. Becasue of this, I never, ever feel like I have any money, although I do have wiggle room in my budget if I needed it

Back in my twenties, I also was living paycheck to paycheck. But, fairly lavishly, all things considered. I did not have specific financial goals I was saving for, such as house, wedding, retirement. A 20K nest egg would have been nice, but it was not needed, because with a few tweaks in my budget, I could have decided to start saving and blow the 20K on something else.

This is why I find it hard to tell the OP that she really should absolutely save the 20K. It's a gift of cash. If she's not hurting for money right now, she can probably find a way to begin her own nest egg without feeling like she "has" to save the 20K. Additionally, part of me does feel that there's something to be said for a fantastic experience now. I do believe that rainy day savings are nice. . .but you only live once.

I once had a great opportunity to travel to Tokyo but did not because of how insecure I felt financially. I regret that decision now. Even knowing that if I'd gone, and disaster had struck, I'd have had to depend on my parents. . .I still regret not going to Tokyo.

Last thought: Is a 20K gift really that different than spending 20K generally? If it's not okay for her to spend a 20K gift on a wedding, then it's really not okay for her to spend 20k, period, if doing so means she's not saving money. Let's say that she took a second job, saved for her dream wedding, then blew all the money she'd earned. . .at the end of the day, she'd still be in the same place: no savings at all.

__________________________________________

"I'd hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, or insanity, but they've always worked for me." Hunter S. Thompson

Reply


feministbride Posts : 14 Registered: 2/27/10
Re: To budget or not to budget.. that is the question
Posted: May 13, 2010 9:49 AM Go to message in response to: TripleDagger3

If I had a backyard big enough for a wedding I'll defintely do that. In all reality $20,000 won't really buy you much of a wedding (my wedding is $200pp for dinner and that is the cheapest place in the entire city!) and you are a grown woman don't tell your parents to give you money. My fiance and I are paying for our own wedding even though my parents offered to pay for it. Our parents already spent enough to raise us, why should we take money out of their funds, their retirements or whatever for our wedding. Time to cut the cord. Just stick to something that you and your fiance can afford-i'll like to say that 2-3 months of income for you and your FH should be the cost of wedding allowing your parents to foot the bill that is just selfish in my opinion.



Edited by: feministbride on May 13, 2010 9:55 AM

Reply


feministbride Posts : 14 Registered: 2/27/10
Re: To budget or not to budget.. that is the question
Posted: May 13, 2010 10:13 AM Go to message in response to: auntofthebride

My fiance and I are "fiancially stable" for our age group (both in our 20s)

No debt no even college loans (I'm using GI Bill, he attended a state college and paid off the det within a year of graduation. no parental support for neither of us)

We each have over $100,000 in savings or other investments.

We plan on buying a house when we choose to "settle down" which would be when I finish college and move out of state. We do not want to invest in the state that I am in for college since we don't plan on staying here after I graduate.

We paying for our own wedding with money NOT taken out of our savings.

Just cause someone is in their 20s does not mean that they are living paycheck by paycheck. I was making roughly $32,00 a year from age 18-22 (military) I was able to save around $28,000 of that each year. Now I am in college and just living off my GI Bill living stipend and a part time job I still am able to save. Fiance is bringing home $45,000 and saves around $30,000 of that (less this year cause of the wedding) Our wedding will probably be around $35,000 and we splitting the cost in half-minus my dress and his suit which we will each pay for our own. I fell in love with a dress that is $5600 and even as my mom says "You should get it. I'll pay for it" I realize that spending that much is ridicules so I looked around and found a similar dress for $1200...and still looking to see if I can find something for even cheaper and of course my mom is not paying for it! I feel that if you are happy with yourself, your life that you won't want all the material thing.

It is not about how much you make but how much you save. I have friends who make $100,000 and spend $110,000 and they will forever be in debt.



Edited by: feministbride on May 13, 2010 10:13 AM

Reply


auntofthebride Posts : 9,354 Registered: 4/2/06
Re: To budget or not to budget.. that is the question
Posted: May 13, 2010 11:04 AM Go to message in response to: feministbride

Dear FB,

"Just cause someone is in their 20s does not mean that they are living paycheck by paycheck."

Of course not. I was addressing the posts written by two diffferent people who said they were living paycheck to paycheck. I was pointing out the fallacy of doing that, and relying on parents as a backup. Lots of other posters, ladies in their 20s, said the same thing. They are striving for financial security.

"We each have over $100,000 in savings or other investments."
"No debt no even college loans"

Fabulous. Really great. I mean that. I have tears in my eyes thinking of how proud your parents must be of you both.

It's up to you, but since you have done so well in saving and avoiding debt, if I were you I'd go ahead and buy that $5600 dress. It's totally your money and your decision, but with your history of stellar saving and investment in your future, plus your military service and sacrifice for a greater good, I'd say go ahead and reward yourself in this one giant extravagent splurge. Buy the $5600 dress.

Reply


ArtBride Posts : 4,838 Registered: 5/9/07
Re: To budget or not to budget.. that is the question
Posted: May 13, 2010 2:15 PM Go to message in response to: feministbride

Aww, now I'm just depressed! :)

Good for you! I agree with AOTB that you deserve to splurge on something. You obviously have good financial habits, so one splurge isn't going to hurt - and like MsD said, you only live once. If not the dress, then splurge on something else for yourself.

DaisypathWedding Ticker

Vice President and Guardian of the Toilet Brush of POOP: People Offended by Offended People

Reply
RSS

Thank You
for Signing Up!

Check your e-mail inbox for the latest updates from brides.com

Give a Subscription to Brides Magazine as a Gift
Subscribe to Brides magazine