Stay at Home Wife Stigma?

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starfish701 Posts : 465 Registered: 12/10/08
Re: Stay at Home Wife Stigma?
Posted: Mar 25, 2010 3:52 PM Go to message in response to: cyndi33

I am a bit offended by the idea that divorce equates to emotional abuse. My parents got a divorce after 22 years of marriage. I was 17 at the time and have to say it was the BEST thing that could have happened. Living in a house with parents who where "going through a rough patch" was awful. You could just feel the tension every time you where in my house. Now my mom is happier, ,my dad is happier and I am happier!

FH parents also got a divorce and I say thank G-d they did. They where not happy, it was making everyone else unhappy and the stress was killing FH. Now the divorce is final and things are settling down and the world is a much brighter place.

My aunt who was a SAHW and her F*cktard ex just finalized thier divorce. Yes she is dirt poor, cannot find a decent job (even though she has a masters degree), and is struggling just to make ends meet. However, despite all that she is so much better off divorced. The kids are better off (well not financially but emotionally). You can actually see the oldest child calming down and becoming a happier more well adjusted person.

Sure divorce is not ideal but sometimes it is the right thing.

Still my aunt would have been in a much better situation had she planed for the possibility.
wedding tickers

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AmyJustin2010 Posts : 201 Registered: 1/18/10
Re: Stay at Home Wife Stigma?
Posted: Mar 25, 2010 4:03 PM Go to message in response to: starfish701

Now let me explain--I didn't mean to say that all people who divorce are abusing their children. There are perfectly good reasons to get a divorce, like spousal or child abuse.

What I meant to express was that in my situation that's how it affected me. That isn't to say it affects everyone in the same way as it affected me. However, after it had such a profound effect on my life, it has greatly changed my opinion and my course of actions if I was ever in the situation that my parents were in.

ETA: MrsM, I know what you're saying and I'm also sorry for attacking you before. I'm considering going for a Masters once I finish my 4 years TBH. That would depend on where we are at the time and what programs are in the area that are accredited.

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ArtBride Posts : 4,838 Registered: 5/9/07
Re: Stay at Home Wife Stigma?
Posted: Mar 25, 2010 4:06 PM Go to message in response to: AmyJustin2010

Anybody could sit here and say "what if." What IF your husband dies and then what IF you can't find any work then what IF you find a job and quit because you become ill, then what IF someone breaks into your house and steals your identity then what IF the Yellowstone volcano erupts? WHAT IF?!?!?

With all due respect, having a way to support oneself in the event that one's marriage ends isn't a waste of time, and it's incomparable to preparing for random disasters that are unlikely to happen. (Though while we're on the subject, don't you take precautions against burglary, identity theft, and natural disasters common to your area? You'd be pretty stupid not to.) It's a common situation that happens to MANY women. Many women, I might add, who never expected to get divorced or widowed. And it happens to women who don't believe in divorce, as well. My mother is a devout Catholic (so doesn't believe in divorce), but she left her first husband due to abuse. And don't say that it will never happen to you, because you don't know that for sure. A young friend of mine recently left her husband, as he was also abusive. Before the wedding and for the first year of marriage, he was an angel. He later did a complete 180, which is frightening. Do you think she would have married him if she'd known? Of course not. People can randomly change, and if it happens to you, you'll regret not having a backup plan.

One of DH's coworkers has a stay-at-home wife. The couple does not have kids yet, so she's basically the homemaker, like some of the PPs. Now here's the thing that bothers me. I recently had a conversation with this man about a similar topic. He suggested that he should make more money than I do because he is the sole provider of his household. For the purpose of this conversation, the fact that he and I are in totally different careers - and that I actually make quite a bit more money than him - is irrelevant. He was saying that if he and I were to have identical jobs, he should make more money because he's the breadwinner of his household, whereas DH and I both work. He also believes that he should make more money than DH (who actually do the same exact job for the same exact salary) because he's the sole provider for his household. I think everybody here will agree that this is incredibly sexist and unfair - but it happens. So for those of you who don't believe (or don't care) how your staying at home affects women in the workforce, what do you say to that? Say your husband works in my office. Is it fair of him to ask for more money to do the same job, just because you stay home?

Thanks for the congrats about the promotion (can't remember who said it), but it hasn't happened yet. My boss is retiring soon, and I will be able to apply for the position. While it will (most likely) still be a competitive opening, there is nobody on this earth who would be more qualified for that job than I am, so they'd be stupid not to give it to me. So while it's not in the bag yet, I'm pretty confident!

DaisypathWedding Ticker

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cyndi33 Posts : 2,585 Registered: 1/3/07
Re: Stay at Home Wife Stigma?
Posted: Mar 25, 2010 4:11 PM Go to message in response to: AmyJustin2010

Amy, I am just trying to urge you to think more about your safety plan. Going later for a masters, having zero work experience in your field, and knowing you will need a job within 2-3 years, to me seems like a very up in the air/incomplete/unsafe plan. I would say the same to my daughters and to friends. I have also observed and lived the struggle when those unexpected things happen and it can be very devastating, very scary and so difficult!! I say that having come out of a situation where I had to do it on my own, and it is tough! It is even more tough with young children in the mix.

As far as divorce, I agree with what Star wrote. And most other PPs.

Art, congrats and I hope it is formally finalized soon!!


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AmyJustin2010 Posts : 201 Registered: 1/18/10
Re: Stay at Home Wife Stigma?
Posted: Mar 25, 2010 4:14 PM Go to message in response to: ArtBride

I guess I don't see where I have indicated that I will have no way to support myself in the case of a divorce. By our first anniversary I will have a four year degree. It wouldn't be easy, but in that case I could get a job (even an entry level one) and put myself through school for the Masters degree. Also, in this state it is quite common for teachers to finish their Masters after getting their first teaching job. Quite a few of my HS teachers were working on their Masters degrees while teaching.

I do agree with you that salary shouldn't be based on how many people someone supports, but how they perform in the workplace. It is ludicrous for him to suggest that he make more than you just because he has "more people to support." The decision between him and his wife for her to stay home is their decision, but they should really be prepared to live with the consequences of their choice. In this case it means they have less money to live off of. I think he's off his rocker or him and his wife want their cake and to eat it too. You can't have it both ways--either you both work and have more money, or one works and you have less money.

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WinterWonderlan... Posts : 658 Registered: 8/23/08
Re: Stay at Home Wife Stigma?
Posted: Mar 25, 2010 4:26 PM Go to message in response to: starfish701

I just wanted to throw my little opinion in here...Even though I almost NEVER post anymore, I do still stalk the board from time to time :)

I believe that people do use divorce too often today as an easy out instead of trying to work out their issues. But on the other hand, I think a lot of those same people jump into marriage way too quickly. We can just open any tabloid to see that. Married today, Divorced next week, Remarried next month. But even with normal everyday people, divorce is way too common these days. Do I think someone should waste 15 years of their life working out a "rough patch?" No, life is way too short. I also believe that no one should ever stay in an abusive relationship.

Now on the issue of being a stay at home mom/wife or not. Let me begin by saying that I've graduated from college and have a very stable career in the medical field, as does DH. So you can say my job is a stressful job. DH & I both have a joint savings account and our own seperate savings account, we contribute to all 3 on a regular basis.

As for being a stay at home wife, I've never thought about that as even being an option. However being a stay at home mom is something I would love to do in the future, at least until my child started school. I don't think that will ever be a possibility for me, as we need both salaries to live the lifestyle that we want. This is something we would both like though, so we are taking steps now for the future. We are saving money now to build up our savings account so that maybe a few years down the road when we have a child, I will be able to stay home for the first year, and then possibly work part time from then until the child starts school. I would love to be able to be home for my child longer than that, but I also want to be able to travel with my child and give them a certain type of lifestyle.

If we could afford for me to be a stay at home mom I defintely would, and would get pretty upset if someone tried to give me a hard time about it. It is my decision as what to do with my life. I find my job to be pretty stressful and tiring most of the time, so I imagine it would be difficult with the added stress of children. I believe that has a lot to do with this situation. I do not love my job and the stress that comes with it, but it seems as though a lot of the posters do and aren't in as stressful situations. If I loved my job, maybe I would feel differently and not want to leave it.

As for having a plan for being a stay at home wife/mom, I think that is a good idea. If I was a stay at home mom and not working even part time, I would continue to renew my license every year so that if something happened I could go back to work full time. I'm 100% sure that 20 years down the road people will still be just as sick as they are today, and need just as much healthcare as they do today. I know that even if I was out of the workforce for a while I could walk back into a good paying job because of my qualifications and the continuous need for health care employees. So I think the re-entering the workforce debate depends on the job. Now if you were the executive of some big business or something and then left the workforce for 30 years and then wanted to come back, clearly you are not going to find a job immeaditely making the same salary.

I am happy for the OP that she is able to be a stay at home wife like she wants. I don't believe she should force herself to work if it is making her and her husband unhappy just because she has only tried it for 7 months. I greatly believe life is too short and we shouldn't waste time with things that make us unhappy. However I do encourage you OP (sorry I don't remember your name) to continue to work part-time as you mentioned you were going to and to save money for yourself during your life just in case. You never know what will happen.

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ArtBride Posts : 4,838 Registered: 5/9/07
Re: Stay at Home Wife Stigma?
Posted: Mar 25, 2010 4:31 PM Go to message in response to: AmyJustin2010

ETA: MrsM, I know what you're saying and I'm also sorry for attacking you before. I'm considering going for a Masters once I finish my 4 years TBH.

I know this isn't the point of the discussion, but just as an aside, an MA does not guarantee you a job. I know plenty of people with MAs who are working crappy jobs outside their fields because they don't have enough career experience in their field to get hired. And I've personally thrown away resumes of people with MAs and no career experience, either to go with a candidate with an MA and good experience, a candidate with a BA and good experience, or a recent graduate that seems promising in an interview. I said this recently on another thread, but I'll say it again here: I would rather hire a recent college graduate than someone who earned a degree years ago and has no relevant experience. The recent graduate is inexperienced simply due to lack of time, whereas the person with a degree and no relevant experience chose not to pursue or look for opportunities. I don't care what the reason that the candidate chose not to find opportunities to gain career experience - I just care that he/she didn't. Their resume goes in the trash, because I can find a better candidate.

Also, are you sure you'll be accepted in an MA program? You're currently working on your undergraduate degree, right? What if something comes up and you don't finish it? What if the life insurance money isn't enough to pay for all the education you want to use it for, AND pay your and your children's living expenses until you're finished with school? What if your husband dies in some way that you don't get a penny? (uncommon, but it could happen) What if you need to support yourself not because your husband is dead, but because something else has happened - anything from divorce to unemployment to an injury that puts him on disablity (and if you think you can live on that, forget it) for the rest of his life and you don't have life insurance money to pay for your schooling? I'm not saying this stuff to be mean - but I would advise you to flesh out your back-up plan.

And yes, saying 'You can't prepare for everything in life, so why do I need to prepare for every possible eventuality?' is naive. I do not expect to get in a car accident tonight, but I will still wear my seatbelt. I do not expect to be robbed, but I still lock my house and car and keep a firm grip on my purse. I don't expect to get sick, but I still have the best health insurance I can get. I'm not crazy for preparing for things that probably won't happen. It is wise to be prepared. If you're prepared for anything, the worst thing that can happen is that you have to use your plan. If you're not prepared, the worst thing that can happen is that you're caught off guard in the event of an emergency.

DaisypathWedding Ticker

Vice President and Guardian of the Toilet Brush of POOP: People Offended by Offended People

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WinterWonderlan... Posts : 658 Registered: 8/23/08
Re: Stay at Home Wife Stigma?
Posted: Mar 25, 2010 4:42 PM Go to message in response to: ArtBride

I forgot to say that in relation to our household chores...I suck at cleaning and am often really tired from work. We split the chores pretty well. DH definitely is not the best cleaner, but he'll do laundry/dishes/trash/lawn/etc. I do most of the cooking, DH does on rare occasions, but we both prefer my cooking. Plus when he does cook I'm having to help him most of the time so it defeats the purpose.

As for him staying home with the child instead of me. Yes I do make more money than him right now so that would be the reasonable thing to do, however I couldn't handle that. I would eventually end up resenting him for it. I want to be the one to be able to stay home with our future child, even if it is only for the first year. Now if that wasn't something that was important to me, then I would be 100% fine with any dad being a stay at home dad. Just for me and my family, I want that person to be me.

Also when we do have a child in the future, one of us will have to give up our jobs. We both work 12 hour night shifts. Day cares aren't open in the middle of the night so obviously it isn't possible for both of us to continue those hours. That is definitely not an appropriate routine for a child. So because as I mentioned before, it is important for me to be the parent who is home, I will either switch to a 12 hour day shift job or a 8-5 type of job when we are closer to the baby stage in our life. Not because my husband wants me to be the one to, but because that is something that is personally important to me.

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hhhhhhhhhhhhhhh... Posts : 4 Registered: 3/24/10
Re: Stay at Home Wife Stigma?
Posted: Mar 25, 2010 5:45 PM Go to message in response to: cyndi33

To Cindi33,
Once again you people just shoot off at the mouth. I was married as a teenager and ended up divorced with a child. After being a working mother and seeing how it affected my son, I knew I would never have anymore children if I had to work. Fortunately for me I met a man who agreed that staying home with my child and any others we would have, would be better. I do know abuse, my first husband abused me terribly, so I left him. But guess what? I made it just fine without him, NEVER going on welfare or any assistance. So quit making women feel that unless they follow yours and every other working womans path of thinking, that they will just be failures. I've know people who didn't get married until they were in their 30's and were divorced a few years later, and some who married at 20 and are still together 30 years later, and vice versa. Why is it that all you working women can't get your point across WITHOUT putting down another woman's choice? Does it make you feel stronger, more intelligent, or better in some way? If I want to say that the homes I've been in where a woman is a stay at home feels "homier", so what? That's an opinion of a home. You can say that you don't feel a difference in a home weather a woman works or not, and that's just fine. But do you have to ATTACK someone else's views? To me that shows a lot of insecurity in a person if all they can do is make it seem that a woman like me, who found total happiness in being at home, is a fool, or stupid, or a throwback, or any of your other negative explitives. Basically, all you women who have to attack a stay at home, are just like the school bullies, always trying to make some see it their way, or no way.

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cyndi33 Posts : 2,585 Registered: 1/3/07
Re: Stay at Home Wife Stigma?
Posted: Mar 25, 2010 5:56 PM Go to message in response to: hhhhhhhhhhhhhhh...

Dear hhhh,

YOU are attacking US. Or does that not count because you are a stay at home so you can say whatever you want, because it is your opinion? That's fine hhhhhhh. But, you know what? I can express my opinions as well, and will continue to do so. Your posts make no sense, you are mixing a whole lot of things that are not related into an argument to come out with the result you want, you use no paragraphs, have horrible grammar and little punctuation. Not only are they nonsensical, they are difficult to read.

If you do not like that, you do not have to read them. Your choice.

Some paragraphs and punctuation would really be helpful. Honestly, your posts in no way come across as written by a 54 year old woman. They appear to be written by a troll, or a previous poster who wanted to go "anonymous" or maybe even a man with all that anger directed at those you perceive to be "feminists".

Why does that term cause such anger for you? To me, it denotes very positive emotions and associations. I like the phrase, and consider it a compliment. Much the way I consider "liberal" a compliment.

I have three adult children as well, and all of them have expressed how much they appreciate all I did for them while they were children and still do today. That does not mean I need to, or ever would, give up my career. The two do not have any relationship with each other. You see, it is entirely plausible to do both, and to do both well.

 Proud Member of P.O.O.P.,  People Offended by Offended People

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hhhhhhhhhhhhhhh... Posts : 4 Registered: 3/24/10
Re: Stay at Home Wife Stigma?
Posted: Mar 25, 2010 6:11 PM Go to message in response to: Agape14

To Agape14,

Look how nasty you people are. You're even criticizing the heading I have. What the hell has you and anyone else who has negative comments about my heading, so damn bitter? The meaning behind my heading is personal and of no consequence to you or anyone else. Agape14? Should I criticize your heading? More and more you further validate my opinion of extreme feminists. You can't even stick to the subject at hand without going off on another thing to put someone down about. Now THAT'S a pathetic person. I state my opinions on the joy I had staying at home and it's almost like all you feminists are so insecure that unless a woman follows your beliefs, you think she's nuts. Get real, grow up, everyone makes a choice. For goodness sake, just wish them happiness. All the negativity you people are putting out there is surely to come back at you. It's ok to tell someone that they might want to be sure they'll have a plan if something happens, but jeez, leave it at that and leave out all the horrific doomsday predictions. You're all going overboard with your feminist views. Don't tell me that there haven't been a ton of working married women who got divorced and then lost a job. They too have to find a job. And don't even try to tell me that it's ALWAYS easier just because they worked before, it's not always easier. I've know plenty of people with degrees working as cashiers somewhere because that's all they could find, and I've know plenty with no degrees working at very good jobs. Give all the negative advice a rest and just freakin' wish someone happiness. Jeeeeez, you people are unreal.

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ArtBride Posts : 4,838 Registered: 5/9/07
Re: Stay at Home Wife Stigma?
Posted: Mar 25, 2010 6:13 PM Go to message in response to: hhhhhhhhhhhhhhh...

Hhhhhhh, if your home life is so perfect and you're so fulfilled, what brings you to a bridal forum? You've never posted on these boards before. Certainly you must have better things to do with your time than visit random message boards to see if random people on the internet might be talking about stay-at-home-wives?

The rest of the women posting on this thread are members of this community. While many of us are married already, we all first came here as brides-to-be looking for wedding advice. Now we stick around to advise others - and because we made friends with other women on the boards and like to chat with them. So while there's a reasonable explanation for the rest of us to be here having this chat on these boards, I really wonder about the motives of a random 54-year old woman who has never visited these boards and is not getting married JUST HAPPENING to show up now for this conversation.

Sorry, but I don't buy it. Not to mention that I can't get through one of your posts due to the lack of punctuation. And you might want to look into anger management. For someone who claims that her life is perfect and low stress, you sure seem to be carrying around a lot of anger and resentment. Troll, anybody?

DaisypathWedding Ticker

Vice President and Guardian of the Toilet Brush of POOP: People Offended by Offended People

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cyndi33 Posts : 2,585 Registered: 1/3/07
Re: Stay at Home Wife Stigma?
Posted: Mar 25, 2010 6:20 PM Go to message in response to: ArtBride

Yes, troll for sure. But the way you analyzed that made it much more clear!

Are men who plan for their financial security extreme feminists then? Or, does that only apply to women who do the same? I'm having a lot of difficulty following the logic, but, trolls really don't have logic do they.


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hhhhhhhhhhhhhhh... Posts : 4 Registered: 3/24/10
Re: Stay at Home Wife Stigma?
Posted: Mar 25, 2010 6:40 PM Go to message in response to: ArtBride

Your ignorance astounds me. Someone I know who's very young is getting married and wants to stay at home. I told her that I'd see if there were some communities online to help with her decision as she has no mother. When I saw the Stay at Home Wife Stigma letter from Amy, I decided to respond because I know how she feels. I too put up with a lot of negative comments and bashing and being made fun of because I stayed home. So I wanted to assure her that no one can make her choice for her, and that she should be proud of her choice if she stays home. THEN, all you totally mean people started bashing me because I wrote of my feelings on staying home. I know the pain that such cruel words such as yours,calling someone an internet troll, and all the other unkind words and accusations your type of people use, can hurt. But I wanted to help her stay strong and let her know that you just learn to live with it, because you can't turn people kind, either they are or they're not. I don't care if you don't "buy" anything. I'm not here to just agree because it's the "norm" for some women. I saw a young woman concerned about her choice, and so far, the negative manner in which you all are trying to get your point across with, is just awful.

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kelleyiskelley Posts : 11,590 Registered: 7/2/06
Re: Stay at Home Wife Stigma?
Posted: Mar 25, 2010 6:49 PM Go to message in response to: cyndi33

This thread is hilarious.

A couple of things:

1. Im sorry, but I cannot take anyone with the screenname hhhhhhh seriously. I just cant. Its silly.

2. If I hear the phrase "staying home to fix a hot meal for my husband" one more time on this thread or forum, I might literally gag. Since when is a hot meal THIS freakin important? Is this really the most important thing in your lives, and in his, that he comes home to a hot meal? What century are we living in? Honestly. Sometimes I cook. Sometimes DH cooks. Usually we end up ordering take out or our schedules are at such different times that we just sort of fend for ourselves and figure it out. Are you people who are talking about a hot meal DAILY living in 2010? In the same economy Im living in? Never mind all the arguments about whether or not you SHOULD be a "stay at home wife", but how can you even afford to? Im actually confused by this. Pretty much everyone I know in my life is struggling, and even if theyre not, they are very concerned with their financial futures and therefore, both spouses work. I just dont get this hot meal stuff.

3. This is what really bothers me about all of this "stay at home wife" stuff. You are claiming (Sunnijoy and others) that you WANT to stay at home and "keep a clean house, cook hot meals,etc." That actually depresses me. Im not saying that to be insulting --- I just REALLY dont comprehend how any HUMAN BEING man or woman ---could be satisfied and CHALLENGED in their life , when their only purpose is to keep a clean house? To cook for her husband? You ladies arent even talking about being stay at home moms, which to me is totally different, you are talking about being stay at home WIVES. What the hell does that even MEAN? To me, it means that youre not pulling your weight. Lets reverse this for a minute. Lets say hypothetically that your husband came home one day and said "Yeah, I dont think Ill work anymore. Im giong to be a stay at home husband." Um. Yeah. The hell you are lol. My husband would FREAK if I ever said "yeah from now on Im not working anymore. I have dishes to do." He would laugh in my face for about an hour, and Id do the same if he suggested just randomly staying home. Seriously, what world are you living in that this is A. practical and B. purposeful. What kind of life is that? It depresses me that the most important thing to ANYONE would be a "clean house." I just have such a hard time wrapping my head around that. Cleaning your house is a chore. Its just something you have to do. And you do it. You dont leave your job to do it. I feel like Im talking on some sort of strange 1950s message board all of a suddent. This is just very weird stuff.

Im baffled by how anyone can be truly happy with nothing to look forward to other than cleaning a house and cooking hot meals, like a maid. And I know youll say you have your husbands and that youre in love and you look forward to that and being with him etc ---and thats great ---but Im talking about things outside of that. Im talking about beinga complete person. Being whole. How on earth does keeping clean house provide anything at all for your human spirit?

This is beyond bizarre.

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