Living together before marriage

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WoostaBride Posts : 220 Registered: 6/8/09
Re: Living together before marriage
Posted: Feb 15, 2010 1:24 AM Go to message in response to: AmyJustin2010

Amy,

I'm glad you see it that way...
I really don't care what others think in most cases....I was making a point that forgiveness and "sorry's" don't always cut it with us creatures that exist in the flesh. If you believe that He will forgive you on your judgement day, or however you'd like to refer to it, then good for you. I'm just someone who likes living my life for the here and now, and what I do affects my own introspection, as well as the perception of who I am as a human being.

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WoostaBride Posts : 220 Registered: 6/8/09
Re: Living together before marriage
Posted: Feb 15, 2010 1:33 AM Go to message in response to: SMGray

SMGray...

I used the term "bible thumper" for exactly what it refers to - someone who aggressively pushes their Christian beliefs onto people who do not share the same views - and no, I wasn't refering directly to any person on these boards. I was speaking of experiences that I have had in the past, and I believe if you read my post a little closer you could see that. I used the term to make a point ....it's derogatory if you want to view it that way. To me it's just a term with a definition that fits perfectly with what I was talking about. "Christian", or "religious" don't quite put forth the oomph that I was looking for, because quite honestly I don't have a problem with religious Christians...I just have a problem with those who make it their mission to convert me to their way of thinking...aka, bible thumpers. Sorry if you're offended, but it's just a word....don't read into it too much.

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Jream Posts : 157 Registered: 7/29/08
Re: Living together before marriage
Posted: Feb 15, 2010 9:01 PM Go to message in response to: BirdLover

BirdLover, back when I moved in with my best friend who just happened to be a guy (and later turned out to be my husband, but we had no romantic involvement at the time) the people at my church told me that it was an iffy move because it set a bad example. Later, when we ended up falling in love, everyone told me we had to move out because we had to "flee from temptation" and to also avoid "the appearance of sin". Both are scriptures--don't really care to find out where at this point, though I did do thorough research on the subject at the time, and they are legitimate verses. Anyway, so that's really the best anyone else could tell me. Cohabitation is not a sin, but it could easily lead to a sin or could look to others like you're sinning.

I always wanted to ask, so what if it looks bad? I guess because it sets a bad example for Christianity. I think over-zealous Christians set a worse example for Christianity than people banging each other outside of marriage.


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coleapril87 Posts : 24 Registered: 11/11/09
Re: Living together before marriage
Posted: Feb 15, 2010 9:40 PM Go to message in response to: mainstdancer08

Well I've lived with my fiance for over a year now, and am glad I do, the things we've learned about each other and ourselves is amazing in both good and bad ways. You can tell your church that God is the only one allowed to judge and that to let those who haven't sinned to cast the first stone. Premarital sex is considered a sin but cohabitation is never mentioned that I know of, and the church is there to lead people to God, not to turn them away. I hate to hear what happened thats very disappointing. Its all your choice, and what you consider wrong or right. I'm a firm believer in church and the bible and God, but that was a line crossed in my book.

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springorchid Posts : 176 Registered: 4/8/07
Re: Living together before marriage
Posted: Feb 15, 2010 10:24 PM Go to message in response to: SMGray

This really is an intersting thread....

Ah yes, the "we've ben having sex, but we're going to stop for x-amount of time before the wedding" (not based on religious repentance)... I agree with Myra, why would anyone want to put themselves in a situation where they are more stressed for the wedding to be followed by a wedding night that will then be more uncomfortable, more awkard, and singificantly short than had the sex just continued? I mean, I have had times in my life where I haven't had sex for various reasons, and those "first time" back experiences, not the best nights I've ever had.

As for religion, people will believe things for two reasons: they want it to be true...they are scared that it is true (I left out that it is true because religion is based on faith not provable fact).

In summary of the PPs:

She was wrong for rejecting you.

You have to do what you think is right.

We will never all have the same thoughts/beliefs with regards to religion.


But it is so like reality TV (just in slow motion)...maybe, just maybe, if you stick around for long enough there might be a really interesting cat fight.

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RyanandKelly2009 Posts : 32 Registered: 12/10/09
Re: Living together before marriage
Posted: Feb 19, 2010 11:32 PM Go to message in response to: mainstdancer08

If the preacher/priest condones the bible study lady's behavior I would suggest finding a new church. My mother wonders why I no longer go to her church. It's because I got tired of hearing that I'm a sinner and going to hell for the way I live my life! When the bible was made people got married at age 13. Sure I could have waited until I was 13 to co-habitate aka: fornicate. However, when your hormones have been raging since 15 and we don't get married until after 20 it's kind-of hard to do everything by the bible.

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BirdLover Posts : 2,834 Registered: 3/30/06
Re: Living together before marriage
Posted: Feb 19, 2010 11:39 PM Go to message in response to: RyanandKelly2009

I quit going to a youth group when I was a teenager (not at my church, at a friend's) because I was tired of being told I was going to hell, and I was tired of them doing weird things like making the group sign anti-suicide pacts and promise to not be homosexuals and all this junk. It's so sad, because as another said, churches should be about bringing people together, not driving them away.

Unfortunately, churches have a lot of politics involved in them...


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CatStandish Posts : 2,766 Registered: 6/20/08
Re: Living together before marriage
Posted: Feb 20, 2010 9:52 AM Go to message in response to: WoostaBride

SMGray,

I have to agree with Woosta here. Bible Thumper and Jesus Freak might be derogatory terms, but they are also not applied uniformly to ALL Christians. They are applied to specific behaviours.

For example: Pat Robertson and James Dobson... Bible Thumpers (some might call them religious, but I consider them to be hate mongers who are bad examples of Christianity)

That dude who killed the abortion doctor: Jesus Freak

Mr. Rodgers (of Mister Rodgers' Neighborhood, an Ordained minister, btw): Christian.

On this forum alone: AOTB, Art Bride and many others are CHRISTIAN, but I'd never consider to be Jesus Freaks or Bible Thumpers. (Many of the others are people whose real names I know and whose B.c identities have escaped me <G>)

There have been brides on this forum who I consider to be Jesus Freaks or Bible Thumpers, but they are exceptions, not rules.

MOST Christians who I know personally and who I associate with are religious, not Bible Thumpers.

Bible Thumpers (Quran Thumpers) insist that society follow the norms of THEIR religion and really do not care that you do not practice it. You're going to hell anyway, so you might as well learn from the error of your ways now. It's good for you. They seem to need the government to validate their belief structure...since apparently their Faith is not strong enough if it does not have governmental support.

Jesus Freaks (Allah Freaks) believe that the laws of man are irrelevant. If their belief structure allows them to do something illegal to satisfy their beliefs, then they can do it.

I don't care what your religion is. You're free to practice it, but you are NOT free to force me to practice it or to dictate to me what I must do so that it meets YOUR religious standards. If that is what you are doing, then you're not religious, you're a dictator bully and you deserve any derogatory name I can come up with.

If you're following your faith, telling me about it, but respecting my right of Free Will... then I respect you and your faith a hundred times more than I do when I am forced to put up with your faith's nonsense...

Like Blue Laws -- where stores cannot sell alcohol on Sunday, because it is offensive to "people of faith" (I'm sorry...didn't Jesus turn water to wine? Clearly, there is no scriptural mandate against alcohol consumption)

Like Marriage Inequality -- be it between races or between genders

Like Sexuality Discrimination -- where homosexuals are treated like dirt because they do not conform to the faith of that religion

Like Gender Inequality -- If God called a woman to speak his word, who is MAN to say she's not good enough (Hi there, Southern Baptist Convention)

Like Anti-Choice movement -- where people who have no intention to raise that child stick their noses in women's lives and try to prevent her from having an abortion. Apparently, life begins at conception and ends at birth, in how they treat it. (These people have "rescue" programs, but nothing to help those mothers actually raise the babies that they "saved")

The list goes on. And those laws were supported by Bible Thumping Jesus Freaks.


If drinking alcohol on Sunday is against your faith...don't buy it. But don't tell me that I cannot.

If you don't believe in marriage between two people of the same gender, don't date a person of the same gender and don't go to one of their weddings.

If you don't like abortion, don't have one, and keep it zipped until you're ready to procreate (okay...truly, I think that that is a good standard anyway, but that is how I live MY life, not a dictation to yours).


So if you wonder why we have derogatory names for SOME Christians...it is actually because we don't want to tar all Christians with that brush. We want to be specific and speak only of the idiots who are giving your religion a very bad name. Would you rather we said "Christian" with the same amount of scorn we use when we say "Bible Thumper" or "Jesus Freak" or "Bible Thumping Jesus Freak". We need a specific name to refer to those idiots <G>.... and to separate them from the Christians who live the example Jesus set, rather than the one set by Pat Robertson and his ilk.

Misty

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PharmToxGirl Posts : 5,446 Registered: 8/30/07
Re: Living together before marriage
Posted: Feb 20, 2010 10:06 AM Go to message in response to: CatStandish

Cat - Very well said. I had wanted to reply but I couldn't figure out how to word it - You did it wonderfully.

 

 

 

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kennysoldwife Posts : 3,859 Registered: 4/28/07
Re: Living together before marriage
Posted: Feb 20, 2010 2:38 PM Go to message in response to: CatStandish

Very well said Cat,

 

 

 

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Sucks to be you, So glad I am me

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cyndi33 Posts : 2,585 Registered: 1/3/07
Re: Living together before marriage
Posted: Feb 20, 2010 3:19 PM Go to message in response to: CatStandish

Cat,

Beautifully written, and exactly what I mean when I use the terms you referred to.


 Proud Member of P.O.O.P.,  People Offended by Offended People

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cyndi33 Posts : 2,585 Registered: 1/3/07
Re: Living together before marriage
Posted: Feb 20, 2010 3:27 PM Go to message in response to: cyndi33

One other thing<

"Bible thumper," and (you didn't use this one, but as another example)
"Jesus freak" are not phrases to be used lightly in mixed company, so
go ahead and put them on the same list as derogatory racial slurs."

Bad analogy. Bible thumpers and jesus freaks are called such due to BEHAVIOR, but derogatory racial slurs are directed at those BORN a certain race. If someone doesn't want to be called a bible thumper, then, all they need to do is stop the bible thumping behavior. However, you can't change what race you are and derogatory racial slurs are always wrong, it is bigotry pure and simple and there is no place for that. But bible thumper or jesus freak is NOT bigotry. It is exactly as Misty, and others, have described, a way to describe people who exhibit completely offensive behavior cloaked as "christianity" (which, by the way, it is not) and a method for those of us who are offended by it NOT to lump all people who call themselves "christians" into that offensive sub group/s.

Given my experiences iwth "christians" it is WAY better for me to meet someone, learn who they are, and THEN find out they are "christian" because, unfortunately, it is difficult for me not to have a VERY negative connotation associated with the term or label "christian" and if I didn't already know someone I might unduly label them in an unfair way simply because they are "christian". But if I know them first, then I can simply like them for who they are apart from the fact they are also "christian". So for me, that term doe snot have positive meaning.

However, I am capable of appreciating good people simply because they are good people even though they are also christian. I would never call those people "bible thumper" or "jesus freak" because IF they were, then by definition they are not ALSO good people.

 Proud Member of P.O.O.P.,  People Offended by Offended People

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kelleyiskelley Posts : 11,590 Registered: 7/2/06
Re: Living together before marriage
Posted: Feb 20, 2010 8:35 PM Go to message in response to: cyndi33

(standing up and applauding Catstandish for her brilliant post.)

clap clap clap!!!!

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Heidibride30 Posts : 1,201 Registered: 4/16/08
Re: Living together before marriage
Posted: Feb 21, 2010 9:34 AM Go to message in response to: cyndi33

Cat and Cyndi...ditto!

 

Proud member and S.C.A.T. of POOP - People Offended by Offended People

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WoostaBride Posts : 220 Registered: 6/8/09
Re: Living together before marriage
Posted: Feb 21, 2010 11:42 PM Go to message in response to: CatStandish

Cat and Cindy,

You both so eloquently explained the exact point that I was making....so kudos to you. I'm glad we can finally agree on something ;)

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